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How long until mini gets updated?
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Bandit Bill
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2005 6:24 pm    Post subject: How long until mini gets updated? Reply with quote

Well, we didn't see any product updates at WWDC. When do you figure we will see updates to the mini?
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jase
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2005 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my casual, unprofessional opinion, I think that Monday's announcement means the Mini updates will be pretty low key until the switch to Intel chips.

We might see some bumps in memory and hard drive. Stuff they can just tack on to the existing system. But I don't think they'll spend a lot of time making big changes like upgraded video, extra memory slots, or anything that requires serious engineering.

It sounds like the Mini will be one of the first machines moved over to Intel, so I would guess that most of the efforts from here out will go to making that new machine a winner, rather than upgrading the current Mini.
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billabong
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2005 6:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's the 10 million dollar question! MacWorld is another possibility or they could just sneak it in any old day of the week. You'd think Apple would want to do something before back to school time.
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Bandit Bill
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2005 7:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't think there will be any processor upgrades (unless minor speed increases) until Intel. However, I'm hoping for a video upgrade to 64MB and 512MB base RAM. Maybe an off the shelf model with a Superdrive.

Macworld July 11-14, would be good. Sooner would be better. Back to school at the latest. You'll still have people that might think revA and be waiting for revB. In the keynote presentation Steve Jobs said to expect upgrades prior to the Intel switch.
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curt
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bandit Bill wrote:
I don't think there will be any processor upgrades (unless minor speed increases) until Intel. However, I'm hoping for a video upgrade to 64MB and 512MB base RAM. Maybe an off the shelf model with a Superdrive.

Macworld July 11-14, would be good. Sooner would be better. Back to school at the latest. You'll still have people that might think revA and be waiting for revB. In the keynote presentation Steve Jobs said to expect upgrades prior to the Intel switch.


Everyone wants a video upgrade! I know there are a lot of buyers out there wating for it. Hell, I might sell mine and get another one if they upgrade the video to 64MB - 128MB. Intel is too far off for me to worry about. We don't even know what computers will be released first.
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Bandit Bill
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I often wonder if Apple wouldn't be better off informing their customers more. I think customers would be a lot less disappointed.

eg. If you knew for sure that Apple was not going to upgrade the Mini for 1 year you may make the choice to purchase today. Others may wait. In the end you will still sell the same number of minis.
It sucks to play the waiting game for 6 months and not get an upgrade. Wait another 2 or 3 months with no upgrade. Get frustrated and buy. 2 weeks later Apple upgrades the product line and offers no consulation.

I find the Apple waiting game frustrating. With PC's it not so difficult. You know and expect things will change overnight.

Most end users buy an Apple with the intention of using it longer than a PC and want to make sure they are making the right choice at the right time.

At least we now know to expect big changes within the next 1-2 years.
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blazer
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bandit Bill wrote:

I find the Apple waiting game frustrating. With PC's it not so difficult. You know and expect things will change overnight.

Most end users buy an Apple with the intention of using it longer than a PC and want to make sure they are making the right choice at the right time.

At least we now know to expect big changes within the next 1-2 years.


I agree the cycles can be long for things like processors and video upgrades. Perhaps Intel will help Apple shorten the processor and video cycle. But I disagree Apple should change everything all the time. The problem with PC companies is they will throw anything out there like a dart to see if it sticks. Apple doesn't do things that way. They try to refine their products and make each individual platform better. I like this because I'm a creature of habit!
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leftplay
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let's be realistic, I don't think we will ever get 128MB of VRAM in a Mini - ever. The problem isn't the amount of VRAM but the GPU. The Radeon 9200 really shouldn't be matched with OS X Tiger. Sure it's usable but you can't access the full features of Tiger with it.

Let's look at some alternatives.
1)Mobility Radeon 9700 - too expensive
2)Radeon 9600 - probably the cheapest of the three w/64MB
3)GeForce FX - mobile version probably too expensive

I don't know how many users would sacrifice size for better performance, ie 3.5-inch HD? It's a toss up. Put in a 3.5-inch HD, add a better GPU w/more VRAM and you have yourself a pretty darn good system but it will be more expensive and louder. In the end the Mini might be the best how it is right now - at least for $500 you can't beat it.
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devo
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

leftplay wrote:

2)Radeon 9600 - probably the cheapest of the three w/64MB


The Radeon 9600 seems like the logical choice. If it's good enough for the eMac, it's good enough for the mini! Very Happy
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leftplay
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Second problem with any GPU upgrade will be heat dissipation, or lack there of. Anyone see a 9200 chip on any third party graphics card? They all have heat sinks on them, albeit small never the less it's there. Now how did the magical engineers at Apple accomplish putting the 9200 into a small enclosure without a heatsink with sole thermal relief coming from a cheesy thermal pad? The rascals reduced the signal voltage - it also explains why the Mini has a hard time producing a bright picture via VGA at times.

Now if you haven't seen the heatsink size on the 9600 I can say it's much larger than on the 9200. Unless, 1) the next Rev Mini is a bit larger as to fit a better thermal transfer system and 2) you don't mind hearing the fan turn on more often or continuously I can't see anything else except the 9200 in any future Revs of the Mini (with its current design).
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billabong
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

leftplay wrote:

Now if you haven't seen the heatsink size on the 9600 I can say it's much larger than on the 9200. Unless, 1) the next Rev Mini is a bit larger as to fit a better thermal transfer system and 2) you don't mind hearing the fan turn on more often or continuously I can't see anything else except the 9200 in any future Revs of the Mini (with its current design).
Crying or Very sad


Do you think Apple will scrap dedicated memory in favor of Intel on-board video when they switch over?
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leftplay
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="billabong"][quote="leftplay"]
Now if you haven't seen the heatsink size on the 9600 I can say it's much larger than on the 9200. Unless, 1) the next Rev Mini is a bit larger as to fit a better thermal transfer system and 2) you don't mind hearing the fan turn on more often or continuously I can't see anything else except the 9200 in any future Revs of the Mini (with its current design).
:cry:[/quote]

Do you think Apple will scrap dedicated memory in favor of Intel on-board video when they switch over?[/quote]

Difficult to answer because of engineering constraints but most likely not because of features designed into OS X Tiger. It depends on which Intel processor Apple decides to use. If they go with a Pent M then they can use Intel's Mobile 915 or 910 chipset which has built-in graphics memory controller hub. If Apple chooses a "desktop" chip such as Pent D, Pent Xtreme, or Celeron D then it's a different story. However I doubt Apple will use any of the desktop chips due to cost and heat. I just hope they don't put in an old Celeron. Who knows they might just stick with the 9200 with some Intel chip. That's probably the most likely in my opinion.
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billabong
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please...not....the...Celeron! Mad

I found this article.

http://www.cdrinfo.com/Sections/News/Details.aspx?NewsId=13972

The AOpen mini PC or whatever its called this week is using the Intel 915GM (Alviso) platform. The article says the "The Pentium M CPU is supported by the mobile 915GM chipset with integrated GMA 900 graphics" This really leads me to believe the Intel Mac mini will have on-board integrated video.
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Bandit Bill
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm hoping for video that fully supports Tiger and has H.264 hardware decoding. I'm not into playing games. I want it for smooth full screen video playback through Quicktime 7.

Has anyone downloaded Quicktime 7 and watched WWDC keynote on their mini? How did it look?
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curt
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 08, 2005 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't comment on QT7 for Windows. But the WWDC Keynote looks great on the Mac mini. I'd like to see some of those H.264 HD 720p videos, but ya need a G5. Sad
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