123Macmini.com
FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   GalleryPhoto Gallery   RegisterRegister   ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Broadband prices
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    123Macmini.com - Forums Forum Index -> Mac Networking
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
JohnnyBoy
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 3954
Location: West Sussex, South-East England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 4:17 am    Post subject: Broadband prices Reply with quote

For over a year, I've been paying £10 per month for my 2Mbit connection from Virgin Media. But recently, I've been driving past Virgin Media ad posters announcing that new users can sign up to 2Mbit b/band for £4.50/month.

So I became curious - what connection speed do people get if they pay £10/month? I found out from a site that guides people through the current b/band deals. £10 is buying other people a 20Mbit connection! Shocked

It gets worse. I decided to call Virgin to re-negotiate what £10 buys me, so I picked up my most recent bill for the phone number. But June's bill wasn't for £10 - they've increased it to £18... Mad I phoned their number and was put through to a call centre in India (not surprising on a Sunday). The young woman I talked to said that the bill had increased because the offer that I had subscribed to had ended. I said that I wasn't interested in paying 4 times more than other people for the same service. She couldn't help me further but said that I should call Virgin's "Customer Retention" people tomorrow.

Oh, I'll certainly be doing that.
_________________
Intel Mini 2.0GHz C2D (4GB/120GB/SuperDrive/10.5.8 ), 120GB WD Passport, Logitech ergo k/b
iPod Touch (32GB, 3rd gen), iPod Shuffle (512MB, 1st gen)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Cypher
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 3106
Location: North West - UK

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had a lot of dealings over the years with NTL/Virgin retention's dept. When you ring up just remember that they are called retention's, its their job to retain you. Threaten to leave and back it up and they usually offer you good deals, even if you go through and cancel (I've done it a few times) they will usually ring you up and make you an offer to change your mind.

I had my phone, TV and broadband with them so I had no alternative supplier for my broadband. For the last few years I haven't paid line rental on my phone after I cancelled my phone line and arranged to switch to BT. I gave them 30 days notice and had BT ready to go. I cancelled with the retention's dept and when they offer me a small reduction I wouldn't back down, I think my words were politely " look even if you did it for free it would still be crap, none of the features such as caller display work and I need a BT line to cancel my broadband with you, can you just cancel it please". Within a week of cancelling the manager of their retention's dept contacted me. I ended up with half price broadband and free line rental on my phone for 12 months, if I would stay. Luckily for me they messed my bill up 11 months later and grossly over charged me so I got the same deal again when I cancelled that time. I did finally swap my phone to BT in Feb this year and they again tried to retain me, but the cap issue on the broadband is a big one for me and so I refused their phone offers and did finally switch to BT. I also gave them notice of my intent to disconnect my broadband service from them once the BT line was established. At which point they gave me 20MB broadband for 3 months promising me all the problems would have gone away within 3 months. They have spent a lot of money upgrading the network ready for 100MB+ broadband and ipTV services, they are shitting themselves over loosing paying customers. I see this capping lark as a way to try and bring in metered services, get people to pay for a 20MB service as the others as next to useless, get people used to paying more for a basic service. So when ipTV launches metered services can be introduced as people will think to start with they are getting a good deal.

My 3 month 20MB offer has just run out and I dropped my line back down to 2MB a day later I had to ring them and up to up it 4MB as the cap on 2MB was killing me. I will be ringing them this week to cancel completely. I refuse to pay for a capped 2MB or 4MB service when their excuse is the network is overloaded, yet they recently upped all their 10MB customers to a 20MB connection and are currently rolling out an upgrade for the 4MB customers to 10MB. Whilst I've been on the 4MB service I grabbed the 10.5.3 upgrade and then spent the rest of the night crawling along a capped connection Sad not good at all and that’s for £25 a month. Their answer of "try to use your computer after midnight" just isn't good enough.

sorry for the rant Johnny you got me on my favourite subject Wink

Give them hell when you ring them. Cool they don't deserve loyal customers.
_________________
Phil

Mac Mini 2.53GHz - iMac 2.0Ghz - Macbook Pro 2.4GHz - iPad 1 32GB 3G
6TB Netgear Ready NAS NV+ - 6TB Drobo S
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JohnnyBoy
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 3954
Location: West Sussex, South-East England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cypher wrote:
sorry for the rant Johnny you got me on my favourite subject Wink

Don't apologise, Cypher! That's really useful information you've given me. Smile My favourite line was "Even if you did it for free, it would still be crap..." Laughing

I also have a history with NTL/Virgin, and it all stems from their appalling billing service; I've been over-billed, under-billed, not-billed at all, sent other people's bills (and had money taken from my account) and have had my bills sent to other people. I'd had the usual "We're sorry, we'll give you 3 months for free" but eventually it got too much, and I ran to BT with open arms.

Now, I just have my b/band with Virgin (primarily because our BT line is a bit crackly, despite repeated attempts to fix it). They keep sending me the sales bumph to try to get me to sign up to cable TV and a phone line, but I'm not having any of it. BT sends a bill at the same time every month to the correct address for the correct amount to be collected from the right bank account at the right time. Until Virgin does that, I'm staying put. Cool
_________________
Intel Mini 2.0GHz C2D (4GB/120GB/SuperDrive/10.5.8 ), 120GB WD Passport, Logitech ergo k/b
iPod Touch (32GB, 3rd gen), iPod Shuffle (512MB, 1st gen)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Cypher
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 3106
Location: North West - UK

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had a lot of billing issues with them. The big one was 11 months into my first 12 months free period, during which time I was still paying for TV and my phone calls. The deal started in the Feb, but over the following christmas break I got a huge bill which would have overdrawn my account. They had cancelled my offer and decided to back date it, so I suddenly ended up with months worth of charges. I was furious with them, I wouldn't have had a problem with them cancelling the deal as long as they had given me the 30 days notice I have to give them, I would have just walked away and gone to BT. The back dating issue now that one was just bang out of order, I did threaten to take them to court over that one. In the end they backed down and gave me the same deal for another year. That ones just ran out in Feb 08 at which point I switched my phone line to BT, as I was fed up of having my broadband connection capped.

BT gives me more options as it opens up all the ADSL providers. I now for the first time in 10 years can use my home phones properly, with caller display and SMS now working.

My worry is also the crackly line you mentioned. I always had problems with my BT line in the dial up days, which was why I had a second phone line installed. I used the BT line for voice calls and the new NTL line for dialup access. So signing up for a 12 month ADSL contract only to find the line is a problem is a big worry. Sad this is why I excepted virgins 20MB offer 3 months ago, whilst I re-enabled the BT line to see if the crackle was still there, and it is very slightly on windy days.
_________________
Phil

Mac Mini 2.53GHz - iMac 2.0Ghz - Macbook Pro 2.4GHz - iPad 1 32GB 3G
6TB Netgear Ready NAS NV+ - 6TB Drobo S
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chris..S
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 25 Feb 2007
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think with broadband (like many things) you get what you pay for. Cheap suppliers are likely to support their low prices by cutting back on other areas, e.g. customer support, network capacity, maintenance.

I work from home, as such my broadband connection is very important to me. Originally I was with PlusNet. At the end of last year I changed to Be Unlimited. I changed to move to an ADSL2 connection, theoretical max speed 24Mb, which gives me 16Mb down and 1.2Mb up. I pay a little over £20/month for a supposedly unlimited (bandwidth) connection (and a fixed IP). I've not had an issue with Be since I changed. The only issues with I had with PlusNet were related to their ancillary services, email & hosting. Because of those issues I no longer use my ISP for anything other than my connection - relying on freebie add-on services is probably not the best. Google Apps now does my email (I'd recommend anyone to register their own domain name and use google apps for their own email without hesitation).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
trustory
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 15 Jan 2006
Posts: 1316
Location: Cornwall/Devon, UK

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cypher by capped do you mean they limit your bandwidth if you download a lot of stuff? I'm just interested as when I go back to uni in september Virgin will be pretty much my only option for broadband as I don't want to pay for a BT line when I don't use it!
_________________
MacBook 1.83Ghz C2D, 2GB Ram, 160GB 7200rpm HDD, OS X 10.6.5
Harman Kardon Soundsticks II
Elgato EyeTV
iPhone 4 Black 16GB
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JohnnyBoy
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 3954
Location: West Sussex, South-East England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cypher wrote:
I re-enabled the BT line to see if the crackle was still there, and it is very slightly on windy days.

My crackle also seems related to the weather; it gets worse after a good downpour. If BT would just run a glass-fibre cable to my house instead of a length of old bell wire, I'd be sorted! Smile

Chris S, does your broadband come through a BT connection?

Trustory, if Cypher has the same service as me then 'cap' refers to speed - my Virgin account imposes no limit on the quantity of data that I can download.
_________________
Intel Mini 2.0GHz C2D (4GB/120GB/SuperDrive/10.5.8 ), 120GB WD Passport, Logitech ergo k/b
iPod Touch (32GB, 3rd gen), iPod Shuffle (512MB, 1st gen)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Cypher
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 24 Jan 2007
Posts: 3106
Location: North West - UK

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

trustory wrote:
Cypher by capped do you mean they limit your bandwidth if you download a lot of stuff? I'm just interested as when I go back to uni in september Virgin will be pretty much my only option for broadband as I don't want to pay for a BT line when I don't use it!


I'm not sure what the levels are now, they offer unlimited broadband subject to a fair usage policy at peak times. If you go over the limits your account is Traffic Managed for 5 hours.

I think with the 2MB service you can only download 300MB between something like 4pm-9pm, if you go over they drop your speed down to 1MB (mine goes much lower). Once capped the cap stays on for 5 hours. So most of the night for me usually 7pm-12am.

The 4MB service has a slightly higher limit 750MB I think but it also caps you down to 1MB for 5 hours if you go over. I'm currently on this one.

On the 20MB service is something like 1.2GB before the cap kicks in at which time the speed drops to 5MB for 5 hours.

There are also upload limits that trigger the traffic management policy.

I'd be happy if I got 2MB all the time. During the week I only use the internet between about 6:30 and midnight so a 1MB or less service is all I get from Virgin for £25/month ($50)
_________________
Phil

Mac Mini 2.53GHz - iMac 2.0Ghz - Macbook Pro 2.4GHz - iPad 1 32GB 3G
6TB Netgear Ready NAS NV+ - 6TB Drobo S
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JohnnyBoy
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 3954
Location: West Sussex, South-East England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure that I could survive if I had an ISP that said I could only download 'x' gigabytes per month. I mean, the 10.5.3 update was 420MB on its own.
_________________
Intel Mini 2.0GHz C2D (4GB/120GB/SuperDrive/10.5.8 ), 120GB WD Passport, Logitech ergo k/b
iPod Touch (32GB, 3rd gen), iPod Shuffle (512MB, 1st gen)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Chris..S
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 25 Feb 2007
Posts: 704

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, its over a BT line. For some reason my street was never cabled, so virgin isn't an option.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bandit Bill
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 5985
Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JohnnyBoy wrote:
Now, I just have my b/band with Virgin (primarily because our BT line is a bit crackly, despite repeated attempts to fix it)


They can fix it. My previous job was a telco technician. I could have told you exactly what the issue was (with testing) and easily resolved it.

I'm assuming BT is British Telecommunications and you are getting phone service through standard 2 wire copper cable.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JohnnyBoy
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 3954
Location: West Sussex, South-East England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bandit Bill wrote:
They can fix it. My previous job was a telco technician. I could have told you exactly what the issue was (with testing) and easily resolved it.

I'm assuming BT is British Telecommunications and you are getting phone service through standard 2 wire copper cable.

You're absolutely right Bill, we used to call it British Telecom before the branding guys were paid thousands to change it to "BT" Laughing

The hardest thing about the crackly line is that it's an intermittent fault. The first two times I reported it, it took 2 or 3 days before the engineer arrived, by which time the fault had disappeared.

The next time it occurred, I recorded it on my dictaphone and then called it in to BT. When the engineer arrived that time, I had some evidence that there really was a problem. He swapped the 2-wire copper cable between the house and the big connection box at the end of the street, and it was fine for a while, but the crackling soon came back. I even believe that the cable between the connection box and the phone exchange was changed, but that hasn't cured it.

I'm beginning to think that there's no solution. Sad
_________________
Intel Mini 2.0GHz C2D (4GB/120GB/SuperDrive/10.5.8 ), 120GB WD Passport, Logitech ergo k/b
iPod Touch (32GB, 3rd gen), iPod Shuffle (512MB, 1st gen)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bandit Bill
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 5985
Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 12:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your phone signal originates at a central office or in some cases a UMC (remote cabinet) from there it goes to a pedestal or an arial can and then to your residence or a box on the outside of you house and then into your house.

There can be more connection points. Having a technician simple change one thing may not solve the issue. If the tech isn't using equipment to determine/isolate the source of the issue it might take 10 attempt to replace everything.

The issue may be moisture related. There are still ways of resolving this.

Basically I wouldn't give up. Unless the issue is within the wiring in your home, you won't get a bill. Typically there is a demarcation point (point where telcos lines end and your inside wiring begins). There is usually a test jack that you can plug a phone into and another jack that will disconnect your inside phone from the network). If you can find that jack (usually near electrical panel or on outside of house) you my be able to plug a phone in and listen for the noise. You can then determine if it on the telcos network or a result of something related to your inside wiring. (assuming your handset (phone) isn't the issue).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JohnnyBoy
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 13 Jul 2007
Posts: 3954
Location: West Sussex, South-East England

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 4:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bandit Bill wrote:
There is usually a test jack that you can plug a phone into and another jack that will disconnect your inside phone from the network). If you can find that jack (usually near electrical panel or on outside of house) you my be able to plug a phone in and listen for the noise. You can then determine if it on the telcos network or a result of something related to your inside wiring. (assuming your handset (phone) isn't the issue).

Yes, BT had me try two different phones with the test jack before they would send out their engineer. Needless to say, it wasn't the phones.
_________________
Intel Mini 2.0GHz C2D (4GB/120GB/SuperDrive/10.5.8 ), 120GB WD Passport, Logitech ergo k/b
iPod Touch (32GB, 3rd gen), iPod Shuffle (512MB, 1st gen)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bandit Bill
Veteran Member
Veteran Member


Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 5985
Location: Edmonton, AB, Canada

PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JohnnyBoy wrote:
Bandit Bill wrote:
There is usually a test jack that you can plug a phone into and another jack that will disconnect your inside phone from the network). If you can find that jack (usually near electrical panel or on outside of house) you my be able to plug a phone in and listen for the noise. You can then determine if it on the telcos network or a result of something related to your inside wiring. (assuming your handset (phone) isn't the issue).

Yes, BT had me try two different phones with the test jack before they would send out their engineer. Needless to say, it wasn't the phones.


Well that's good then then can keep sending guys out until they fix it then. You don't even have to wait at home for them to do their job.

If they don't fix it they are just being lazy and they don't deserve your business. They are a telco. They should take pride in providing a clean, clear phone signal. I can understand issues with a Telco trying to provide television service, but not phone service.

BTW likely your telco is running fiber to a cabinet within your neighborhood. From there it will be copper (or a copper/fiber combo) to your home. If weather related, the issue is likely between that cabinet and your home.

I recommend you record the noise again and have them dispatch another tech to resolve the issue. Have the tech remove any bridge taps on the line, while they're at it.

Either that or live with a crackle (and likely packet loss).
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    123Macmini.com - Forums Forum Index -> Mac Networking All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



      

Shop:  Apple Store  |  Refurbished Macs  |  Refurbished iPads  |  MacConnection  |  Mac Mini Vault  |  Other World Computing

MK 1 Studio Mac mini Racks  |  Crucial Mac Memory  |  Top Free Mac Apps  |  Top Paid Mac Apps



123Macmini.com is an independent publication and has not been authorized, sponsored, or approved by Apple Computer, Inc.
All logos and trademarks in this site are property of their respective owners.
Copyright © 2011 123Macmini.com. All Rights Reserved.