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File transfer / streaming rates
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sandor
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ClunkClunk wrote:
sandor wrote:
this is not correct. one of the major improvements of "N" is that "G" devices will *not* slow down "N" devices when used on the same network.

Apple says otherwise.
Apple wrote:
Speed and range will be less if an 802.11a/b/g product joins the network.

From what I've read, if an 802.11g client joins the network, the 802.11n clients drop down to about 108mbps, while the 802.11g clients connect at 54mbps.


All i know is that in first hand use, i can sustain my normal 10 MB/s transfers on my "N" Macbook even when my wife is connected with her "G" Macbook.
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Pleiades
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandor wrote:
All i know is that in first hand use, i can sustain my normal 10 MB/s transfers on my "N" Macbook even when my wife is connected with her "G" Macbook.

That's in line with what I've read about 802.11n slowing to about 108mbit/sec when an 802.11g client joints the network. 10mbytes/sec is only 80mbit/sec, far below 802.11n's max of 248mbit/sec, which would probably require an 802.11n-only network.
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sandor
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 5:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ClunkClunk wrote:
sandor wrote:
All i know is that in first hand use, i can sustain my normal 10 MB/s transfers on my "N" Macbook even when my wife is connected with her "G" Macbook.

That's in line with what I've read about 802.11n slowing to about 108mbit/sec when an 802.11g client joints the network. 10mbytes/sec is only 80mbit/sec, far below 802.11n's max of 248mbit/sec, which would probably require an 802.11n-only network.


how many people ever got close to "G"'s 6.75 MB/s max? i only ever managed to get a little less than 2 MB/s so i figure getting 1/3 of "N';s theoretical max is about right as well (same house, same metal studs same walls, etc) others may get better overall speeds, but i got a 5x jump in throughput going from "G" to "N"


even in 5 ghz mode which is automatically "N" only, i get 10 MB/s transfers ( this is testing with Aja's system test utility -->

http://www.aja.com/ajashare/AJA_KONA_System_Test_v2.app.tar


**EDIT**

This chart lays it out *very* nicely - max spec wireless is a bit of wishful thinking:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE_802.11#Summary


Actual throughput of wireless is akin to the chart here:
http://www.intel.com/standards/case/case_802_11.htm

scroll down a bit to where it has the b/g/n throughputs "OTA" compared to "MAC SAP" - MAC SAP is what you are actually expected to get for maximum real world throughput, after all the overhead is taken out.
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Pleiades
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quite true, max specification rarely is reached in real world circumstances, and is not terribly useful for comparisons.

I do not have an N router to test this, but if you have all N based devices on your network, and no G devices, and you check Network Utility, what does it say? And what does it say when you do have G devices connected? I'm curious as to if the machine reports any link speed differences.

Here's where to look in Network Utility:

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sandor
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

network utility reports the link connection as 130 Mbit/s in n/g and n and 5 ghz mode, with and without g clients.. no difference for any of them.[/img]
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Pleiades
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandor wrote:
network utility reports the link connection as 130 Mbit/s in n/g and n and 5 ghz mode, with and without g clients.. no difference for any of them.

What about if you set your router to an 802.11N only mode (not an 802.11b/g/n compatibility mode)?
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sandor
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 04, 2008 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ClunkClunk wrote:
sandor wrote:
network utility reports the link connection as 130 Mbit/s in n/g and n and 5 ghz mode, with and without g clients.. no difference for any of them.

What about if you set your router to an 802.11N only mode (not an 802.11b/g/n compatibility mode)?


yup, i tried it in:

n/g w/ and w/o g clients
n
n 5 ghz

all report the same 130 mbps in network utility.
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Doug Eldred
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thought I'd jump in with a few results of my own. My AirPort Extreme arrived yesterday.

(1) I'm clearly getting downloads from the Internet that are consistent with Comcast's posted speeds - 6 Mb/sec with "turbo" 12 Mb/sec, not much different that I did before with the AirPort Express.

(2) I'm clearly getting much faster (than Comcast) transfers between the AirPort Extreme and my Apple TV, some approaching 30 Mb/sec. That's also faster than the AirPort Express, which was more like 15 Mb/sec, still faster than Comcast's rated speed or turbo speed.

(3) I'm using the "b/g compatible" option on the Wireless tab, and unlike the AirPort Express that I previously used this seems to work in spite of heavy 2.3 GHz interference from my wireless 5.1 setup in the room where the Apple TV resides. I expected "n-only" to work, but it's great that "b/g compatible" also works, because that lets my iPod touch continue to have access without twiddling with AirPort settings. (Now if I could just get my Palm TX to understand WPA...)

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Pleiades
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doug Eldred wrote:
(2) I'm clearly getting much faster (than Comcast) transfers between the AirPort Extreme and my Apple TV, some approaching 30 Mb/sec. That's also faster than the AirPort Express, which was more like 15 Mb/sec, still faster than Comcast's rated speed or turbo speed.

Since this transfer is occurring within your LAN, it doesn't really matter what Comcast's rated speed is. It could be 128kbit, and it wouldn't affect this situation at all.
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Doug Eldred
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 16, 2008 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Right, and that was sort of the question that started this thread, whether a -n network would transfer between the MacBook and the Apple TV only at cable-modem speed, or faster. It did seem as though the AirPort Extreme needed to have SOME Internet access, though, perhaps just for DNS and the like.

Since I wrote yesterday's update, I've learned a little more. The b/g-compatible mode is better than the AirPort Express -g was, but I'm back to n-only to get the best transfer rates when I'm using the 2.3 GHz wireless speakers downstairs. I'll just have to switch to b/g-compatible mode when I really need home Internet access for my iPod touch, which should be fairly rare.

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Z06jerry
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 03, 2008 7:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my location I found the range of "n-5ghz" to be much worse than "n-(b/g compatible)". At approx 40' through a couple of walls I will get full signal strength with my Extreme set to n-(b/g compatible) and no connection at all with "n-5 ghz". I have read that n can be worse through walls than g. All devices on my network are n.

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles/08/04/02/exploring_time_capsule_time_machine_over_the_network_vs_usb.html
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tlou37
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sandor wrote:
ClunkClunk wrote:
sandor wrote:
network utility reports the link connection as 130 Mbit/s in n/g and n and 5 ghz mode, with and without g clients.. no difference for any of them.

What about if you set your router to an 802.11N only mode (not an 802.11b/g/n compatibility mode)?


yup, i tried it in:

n/g w/ and w/o g clients
n
n 5 ghz

all report the same 130 mbps in network utility.


I have an 802.11n Airport Extreme and a 802.11n Express on my network at home with only two macbooks that connect wirelessly. Not sure why you are only showing 130 mbps if yoou have an "n" only network. Mine show 300 mbps. i'll try to post the picture but I'm not sure if i know how to post it right.
[img]/Users/tlewellyn37/Desktop/Picture 1.png[/img]
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tlou37
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

guess not...
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hackersmovie
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tlou37 wrote:
guess not...

You have to upload it to some online picture hosting service, then you can place the [img] [/img] wrappers around the link to display it in the post. . .
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